You will find that when you're flying around, will always be slightly below the crosshairs on the navball. surface of jool. Another approach, which I was managing with some success before I figured out jets, is to build a rocket and catapult yourself towards the measurement point. Turbojets are so ridiculously efficient that it doesn't really matter. My question is really about controllability. 3x06: I design a new, high altitude, jet to collect high atmospheric science. What altitude and speed should I go? If that's all a case of Too Many Words, think of it this way: Suppose you just build a plane the "default" way and don't put any. Is it possible to get to an altitude of 16-20km with normal plane engines? So if you replace the turbos with basic jets, you will have more thrust from the ground up, and your vessel will weigh slightly less. As said above, the Wheesley is specifically designed as a low altitude engine. Why that? Cheers again fellas. Typically, I watch my Apoapsis as I boost to the high altitude, and there's enough momentum to coast to the peak before completely running out of fuel. Secondly don't think of engines working better at different altitudes, think of them working better with different air intake quantities. Information Changelog Stats a screenshot of kerbal space program 2. by: lord bird. Your decreased flight time means you probably won't make it to your location. Build a plane or rocket for Kerbal high altitudes, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Screenshot of the Week #85 [Submissions Closed - Vote Now!]. In the main KSP settings menu you should set the default throttle to 1.0 (technically the above mechjeb setting winds up restoring the default throttle, so it needs to be 1.0) In the attitude adjustment menu make sure you are using the "better controller" Whack the 45 degree phase margin button Whack the restore all other defaults button In the stock atmosphere, the benefits of moving faster outweigh almost everything else. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? Powered by Invision Community. If released at a speed of 700 or more m/s and an altitude of 20 or more km, the satellite will achieve orbit with its second stage mostly full, leaving it with approximately 1600 m/s of delta-V -- enough to achieve lunar or interplanetary orbits and, on small bodies, landings. Why is there a voltage on my HDMI and coaxial cables? The U-2 is probably the highest altitude aircraft still flying. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. The more successful the flights, the more successful the space program is. If it's below the cross-hairs, you need a little more AoA. Redoing the align environment with a specific formatting, Trying to understand how to get this basic Fourier Series. Pasted as rich text. Ok, the panther engine is still not good enough. Should i add a larger wing area for higher lift? 3.) 2.) : : . http://www.youtube.com/user/Cruzanak?sub_confirmation=1Quicklinks to topics in this videoJet Engine Concepts: 0:30Air Intakes: 1:13Flameouts: 2:22Control Surfaces: 5:08Flying Tips: 5:57This video will go over everything that you need to know about to design a capable plane that can fly in the thinnest of atmospheres. Since turbos are almost always enough to get you off the ground and up to altitude, I usually just do straight turbojets (with some RAPIERs for SSTO spaceplanes); the minute amount of fuel saved during the ascent isn't worth lugging those superfluous engines around at the hypersonic regime. Imagine that first plane but with the bubble cockpit and the old style round intakes. The flight time won't be as long, but you'll be able to fly a "plane" above 18km. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. It's also worth noting that this engine has the widest thrust vectoring range of all of the jet engines, with a full 10-degree range in all directions. Here's Mr. Manley using it in his tutorial: @Pvt.Grichmann: I think it's at specific locations on Kerbin, not just anywhere above 18km. Rationale: If that's all a case of Too Many Words, think of it this way: Suppose you just build a plane the "default" way and don't put any AoA at all on the wings. You cannot paste images directly. Unfortunately I won't be able to test it today, but @SaintWacko's proposal sounds promising. The most efficient way is, of course, to make a high altitude (or space) plane. You can post now and register later. - Insane TWR didn't help. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. The Rapier, for example, works great as a high-altitude engine, precisely because it can go so fast. Arqade is a question and answer site for passionate videogamers on all platforms. The Panther engine can hold 19,000 steady and oscillates around 20,000. If too much air runs into the turbine, the excessive amount just flows out unused through side-vents (I think). Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? But maybe your patience? Maneuver node plans don't take drag into account, so you'll have to overshoot quite a bit to compensate. If you've attached them to your fuselage with zero AoA, what that means is that when you fly, you're going to have to have the entire plane pitched slightly above in order to generate lift. Your answer got me in the right direction, though I ended up with a different design (see my own answer). Remembering the FW TA152 and the U2 I put long wings on it and while its turn rate makes an airliner look like a fighter plane it is stable enough at 19000m. I also set it to enable the cockpit's reaction wheels to improve control at high altitude, and close air intakes to reduce drag. It may take some practice to hit your target area this way, because you'll be picking up additional horizontal speed, and thus it's possible to under or overshoot. Your link has been automatically embedded. KSP Career: Episode 13 - High Altitude Surveys Mike Aben 28.5K subscribers Subscribe 7.7K views 7 years ago Day 114: A busy day at the KSC with three missions, the highlights being the launch. Any advices for building a vehicle for this task? This thread is quite old. These are the building blocks of solid spaceplane design!Subscribe! EDIT: Essentially, make like an SR-71, if an SR-71 didn't have cooling problems limiting it to Mach 3.4. edited 6 yr. ago. What are the minimum altitudes for each warp level? If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Pasted as rich text. Because when your engine has to take in air forcefully it automatically means there isn't enough surrounding your engine and that again means that air density and therefor air resistance must be pretty low too. But my guess is that these same general principles would probably apply to FAR, and that all that would change would be the numbers involved. Originally posted by lord bird: yep thats right jool has a surface. Even if the air is thin, you can still put out plenty of power if you are shoving enough in with raw speed. This means it is better to have excessive amounts of oxygen than not to. I recommend using a solid rocket booster (or 2 or 5) to you get you the altitude and then launch a small rocket powered plane. Have a plane that ditches its wings and rockets up to 18km once you reach the right point. With only panthers unlocked I might add. It only takes a minute to sign up. She has a horrible turn rate and oscillates a couple of thousand meters at cruise, but it's flyable. The benefits should be obvious. Basically there are two things that limit your maximum speed: thrust and speed of sound and with that your maximum altitude. A temple in the desert (6 29 47 S 141 40 3 W) known as Tut-Un Jeb-Ahn, although this name can only be seen when a vessel crashes into it. Delta-V is the velocity change necessary to perform orbital maneuvers. I would like to know which altitude I have to maintain for my experiments. It is somewhat slow but very steady in flight. Thanks, I'll go try to stuff a few extra turbojets and intakes on my plane Do you know how many intakes/turbojet are needed to run in the regime you described? There is no such thing as "so high radar can not detect it", since radar can detect things in outer space. Well, this game isn't a perfect flight simulator yet, so it will be difficult to figure out. How can I make money in the new career mode? AoA itself refers to the angle of the wing (or the whole plane if the AoI is 0)relative to the airflow. Very cool. Clear editor. Yes. This thread is quite old. I also had problems with a high altitude plane until I decided to follow the K.I.S.S. The maximum cruise altitude is just over 40,000 feet. Air Flow + max. Now I have a plane that will fly around the world at an altitude of the low-20s. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Also, while you mentioned the TJs most efficient altitude is ~ 5km (I'm not sure, but lets assume it's true), you need to realize that the drag you're getting at that altitude is going to wreck any efficiency gains. It is stable but can not maintain altitude. If it's above the cross-hairs, you need a little less. You also need to be going very fast to generate adequate lift at high altitudes and unlike the real U-2, you don't need to fear about overspeeding and destroying the plane. Really. And how many km can I expect to get per v (as calculated by Engineer redux Kerbin atmospheric stats, I know this is weird with planes)? I currently have a contract where I'm asked to take crew reports at certain spots on Kerbal at an altitude of 18,000m. Sideslip handling. 600+ m/s) and low altitudes (e.g. To avoid running out of fuel altogether, I have a second plane with small tanks (no oxidizer) attached directly to the jet engines, and the rockets attached behind the fuselage, which is entirely oxidized tanks. The returns are diminishing so eventually you will hit a ceiling. There's basically three ways to do that: lifting surfaces, thrust, and orbiting. 2/3 (KSP 1.11.2) - YouTube I break out the Mk2 parts and Panther engines to build a better jet that can go higher and faster. Subscribe -. One of my planes is small and agile, and can easily enough glide to a safe landing even if the rockets consume all the fuel. I was even able to do this with three pairs of Junos instead of the large jet engine pair (I don't have the technology level for that). Yes, although they have only been flown with nearly full tanks. If you want to cover your aircraft with loads of intakes, I'm sure you could easily fly above 35km and reach 2000+ m/s velocity. AoA built into the wing relative to the plane body is called the angle of incidence, just to help clear up. Be aware that heat buildup can gradually become a problem when the afterburners are used in sustained flight. Note that KSP planes get one substantial speed benefit that's much more pronounced than IRL aircraft, due to the freakishly small planet sizes: they're actually flying at a large fraction of orbital velocity. Additionally please know that .16 will feature new code that will change the way space planes work in every aspect. The J-404 "Panther" Afterburning Turbofan is a jet engine added in version 1.0.5. rev2023.3.3.43278. Using very light "engine rich" planes and "reverse swooping" (building velocity at 10km then gently curving up) you can temporarily get above 20km with Wheesely and Juno. This makes jets built using this engine considerably more maneuverable. (Actually, four ways: but balloons aren't in the stock game) Lifting surfaces are great but they lose effectiveness just as fast with altitude as drag falls. One problem is i'm running stock on career mode and only have 30 part to spare, so large planes are out of the question. Don't rely on the efficiency indicator! high-1 A Screenshot of Kerbal Space Program By: miklkit This is the current version. Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain, Theoretically Correct vs Practical Notation. Slap that behind a plane you'll be able to go beyond 20km without any trouble. In my case, it brought me to 20km up at a 45-degree angle, but it is probably not optimal. High altitude flight is efficient because the air is thinner, and therefore aircraft experience less parasitic drag. I'm trying to build a high altitude plane and have found out that the rules are different. Note that keeping the plane weight low is critical, only carry a very small amount of fuel. But since when do Kerbals wait for ideal conditions? Been a while since I've flown stock*, but I've heard that, for maximum efficiency, you want one turbojet for every 7.5 tons, and about four ram intakes for each turbojet. It is usually best for initial designs to be based on logic and real-world physics and then be prepared to experiment with non-logical alternatives for optimisation. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Press J to jump to the feed. Now lets combine these two indicators: The best performance your engine can achieve is when you have an optimal amount of Air Flow (obviously) but also the MAXIMUM amount of Air Intake. It will be expensive and time consuming. This lowers their effective "weight"-- for example, a craft flying at 1400 m/s on Kerbin is effectively flying as if gravity were only 2/3 of its actual value. This is my current best hi alt plane. Chapter 4. Air Intake: Air Intake shows the amount of force your engine uses to suck air into the turbine. Using Kolmogorov complexity to measure difficulty of problems? It was meant for low altitude flight. I also added a parachute and decoupler since I find it too hard to correctly land this thing yet ;-) I managed to land in the water once, though. I tried building a plane but can't climb higher than about 11,000m (I don't have many plane parts yet, though). At that point your engines will be running about .7-.8 efficiency and you will be out of the thicker atmo which will allow you to go faster. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. At about 400-500m/s (~15km), the two engines are even. What am I doing wrong here in the PlotLegends specification. Even up there the plane acts squirrely. Your link has been automatically embedded. They will someday, but they don't now. You need to do it with what you've got. First off as of .15.1 intakes don't do anything. That's all true, but just read the OP: hypersonic appears to be completely out of the question. even stranger is that the surface is textured. Your airspeed is mostly limited by terminal velocity; you can go much faster if you climb a little higher. The Kerbal Space Program subreddit. Dedicated to the growth and advancement of amateur rocket scientists! below 5,000 m), since the engine's extreme maneuverability may allow the aircraft to perform turns sharply enough to break up in flight. 1 Pod outside the level 3 VAB. How do I align things in the following tabular environment? This is the first version. 3x06: I design a new, high altitude, jet to collect high. It'll probably be more efficient with more intakes, but I wouldn't increase the number of engines. In this chapter, you ll learn about the Space Plane Hangar, a building that forms part of the Kerbal .